Thursday, Aug 13- In this episode, we interview long-time EWN employee – Red Shaw. Red was approaching retirement and joined the show to discuss the changes he has seen over the years and his likeness to a certain jolly fellow.
Troy Hudson: [0:00] Ladies and gentlemen boys and girls of all ages welcome to the most amazing interview show on the information superhighway. Now zooming to you live and simultaneously from to secret studio bunkers and dual time zones are located somewhere south of Alaska east of Area 51 north of Guantanamo.
[0:19] And if we give you one more clue we’ll all be in deep trouble. It’s the amazing twin namesakes separated at birth the two most famous guys, not in witness protection. It’s “Coffee with Jim & James.”
Jim Schauer: [0:37] Good morning to our LinkedIn community. Well, as you can see this is going to be a very special edition of Coffee with Jim & James today.
[0:45] If you know me white shirts embroidered are kind of my go‑to. So if I wear a red shirt, and if I have on a special hat that’ll give you a little indication as to what’s coming up and I’ll throw these words in here. I’m going to ask. How’s the North Pole how many elves are working up there?
[1:05] And if I were to finally say I may have sat in this man’s lap and asked for a special present. I won’t confirm or deny that but we’ll just let it go at that.
[1:15] As always my brother. My partner in crime. Mr. James Cross is with us James. Did I cross any boundaries today or am I OK?
[0:00] : James Cross: [1:26] I think that’s more of an HR question will help you get to that later Jimmy.
[0:00] : [Red Shaw: [1:29] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [1:30] But no more than normal. I mean that’s that’s your pretty standard intro at this point.
[0:00] : Jim: [1:35] It is.
[0:00] : James: [1:35] But you might have noticed we have a special guest. Mr. Red Shaw’s joining us today. EWN’s own at least for a few more days. So so it’s my pleasure really to introduce Red Shaw you might have realized that the resemblance and Red is actually a professional Santa character.
[1:56] And he’s he’s retiring from EWN this week as we record and so Red it brings me so much joy to have you on today. Welcome to our show.
[0:00] : Red: [2:08] Well, thank you very much. I appreciate the invite. It’s getting close to that time you guys we’re going to have to really watch our Ps and Qs with the good and naughty/nice list, but just work towards a good finish.
[2:23] And guys, you’ve only got 149 days before Christmas gets here, so make sure you take care of your ladies.
[0:00] : Jim: [2:33] James. I have a lot of work to do in the next 148 days.
[0:00] : James: [2:38] A lot of reparations there.
[0:00] : [Red: [2:42] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [2:44] Red, I can’t say any more than James just said. It’s great having you on today, but let me kick this off. You’ve been with EWN, Energy Worldnet for seven years.
[0:00] : Red: [2:55] Yes sir.
[0:00] : Jim: [2:55] Intricate part of the team. You know, how’d you find the company seven years ago? What brought you to EWN what was it? Like give us a little of your your history.
[0:00] : James: [3:08] Tell us your story.
[0:00] : Red: [3:09] A thumbnail sketch. Of that is that we moved my wife and I moved up here in 2004 for caring for our parental units. They were starting to get a little older and looking around to care. I thought I’ll never find anything in my field in this little town.
[0:00] : James: [3:30] That sounds like my story.
[0:00] : Red: [3:32] Huh?
[0:00] : James: [3:33] I said that sounds like my story.
[0:00] : [Red: [3:34] laughs] And so anyway, we were commuting 100‑plus miles a day back and forth. We were going to the Metroplex and having dinner with a couple one night. She mentioned did you see that ad for a tech writer in the paper? Well, I’d given up reading the paper around here. It’s so tiny.
[0:00] : [James: [4:00] laughs]
[0:00] : Red: [4:01] And I went back and pulled the paper out of the recycle bin and showed it to my wife. And she says that’s you you need to apply for it. So I did, had a couple of sets of interviews the with the owners of the company, Dick and Sylvia Hornback great people. And I came in it was the week after the Fourth of July in 2013.
[0:00] : James: [4:31] Wow.
[0:00] : Red: [4:33] And when I came in it was just gangbusters. We the way they put this thing together. We hit the floor running.
[0:00] : James: [4:44] Awesome.
[0:00] : Red: [4:44] It was a great experience.
[0:00] : James: [4:48] So Red you always tell one of the things I was excited about you coming on is you’re one of those people that’s been around obviously for a while at EWN and there’s a lot there’s a lot of them, but you’re one of them.
[0:00] : [Red: [5:04] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [5:05] And you were always one of the first ones to chime in as when we start telling stories and and I was those fellowship times that we have a lot of. And you tell the story of how when you came on board there was really 10 or 12 people, you know in a room. [laughs]
[5:22] And you know for somebody like me who’s been here about four years now going on five and when I started we had less than 40 people and not to me now looking around that seems small.
[5:35] But to to hear the stories out of you and other people that have been there for a long time and hear those 10 or 12 people in a room type of conversations…
[0:00] : [Red: [5:45] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [5:46] …you know, that’s a lot of growth.
[5:47] You know, we’ve had exponential growth in the last five years in particular in my opinion, but tell us, you know, peel back the curtain a little bit on what that looked like. You know, when you joined the team with ten or twelve people really doing the lion’s share if not all the work.
[0:00] : Red: [6:07] Well, we all wore multiple hats had to in those days.
[0:00] : James: [6:11] Sounds like Jimmy.
[0:00] : Jim: [6:13] Yeah. I see what you did there.
[0:00] : Red: [6:18] And it was one of the things that struck me was even at that early time in our existence was the I don’t know what secret formula the Hornbacks and management used to pick the people that they did but it was like sitting down with family. I mean we all matched so well that it was just incredible.
[6:44] And one of the things that, I’m used to working for companies that have hundreds if not thousands of people in them and so you can kind of get lost in there. There’s no way this big redheaded fat guy was going to blend into the wall.
[7:01] So we just got together. I had, I shared my office with another writer and we bounced things back and forth off of each other and it was just fantastic. The way it I guess you’d say melded together.
[0:00] : James: [7:21] Yeah.
[0:00] : Jim: [7:23] You know, it’s interesting just popped in my head that I saw a quote one time people don’t work for companies. They work for people. People work…
[0:00] : Red: [7:30] Yes.
[0:00] : Jim: [7:32] …work with people. And when you get the right mix and that right chemistry, wow, is that powerful.
[0:00] : Red: [7:37] And I thought back to I owned my own business back in the ’80s and part of the ’90s and we were family and working here has been the same way, you know everybody, you know, you’ve seen it grown it’s an amazing process.
[7:58] But it was one quick little add‑on to this is I’ve never worked for a company before that five o’clock for us was you’d be out the door.
[0:00] : James: [8:09] Yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [8:10] And when I heard my boss Mayra jingling her keys, if I didn’t start five minutes before shutting down then I was going to be late getting out of there. [laughs]
[0:00] : James: [8:24] Yeah. No that that is refreshing and that that’s always been a important thing since even since I’ve joined the team was really that and when I say separation, I don’t see it in a negative way. I see it as really you can’t do your best work. If you don’t take that time to sharpen the saw.
[8:42] And that we do that with our families we do that at home. It doesn’t mean that sometimes those things don’t cross paths or or don’t you know, give or take along the way.
[8:55] I heard someone say before it’s not really a work‑life balance. It’s more of a work‑life rhythm we get into and sometimes that rhythm means we work a little bit more but there’s a lot of times when like you said we walk away at five o’clock and you’re able to really sharpen that saw.
[9:15] Red you needless to say you’ve seen a lot of growth within our organization as we said you walked into 10 or 12 people and as you leave, I think we’re pushing 80.
[0:00] : Jim: [9:28] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [9:29] That’s that’s unbelievable to see and what a weird way to wrap this engagement up, right? Is to…
[0:00] : Red: [9:39] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [9:39] …to where you know, yeah. We have some people coming back into the offices you’re in the office today, but you know the last six five six months have been virtual.
[0:00] : Jim: [9:51] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [9:52] What a weird way to put a cherry on top, but but during that time what what are some of the growth you’ve seen and how those changes really have looked over the years as you came on board seven years ago and as you’re walking out the door this week.
[0:00] : Red: [10:11] The technology part of our company, oh, keeping people’s records and reminding them of when things are due when people get need to update their qualifications and things like that. When we first or when I first started we had one IT guy and he was part‑time and remote.
[0:00] : [James: [10:30] laughs]
[0:00] : Red: [10:32] So I’m not sure of the numbers now, but I think we’ve got about 10 or 12 just in IT right now. And they’re some of the sharpest people on the block they’ve got high skills our website and the back end of our website is running so good right now.
[10:52] It was we only had one customer service person at seven years ago. We’ve got a whole slew of customer service people we get out there and take care of the people. That’s always been one of those things that I’ve been always stressed is customer service take care of those people outside because…
[0:00] : Jim: [11:19] Amen.
[0:00] : Red: [11:20] …they’re the ones that are paying your salary.
[0:00] : James: [11:22] Yep.
[0:00] : Red: [11:22] It’s that’s it’s point blank. That’s what I used to instill upon my employees when I had my other business.
[0:00] : James: [11:30] Red when when you started to with 10 or 12 people around you everybody was was customer service at that point.
[0:00] : Red: [11:39] Mm‑hmm.
[0:00] : [James: [11:40] laughs] It was hard.
[0:00] : Red: [11:41] That’s right.
[0:00] :James: [11:41] If the phone rang, you know, if somebody wasn’t around all of a sudden you were just in that role. But…
[0:00] :Red: [11:47] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [11:48] Yeah, that’s a, it’s a big part of it.
[0:00] : Red: [11:50] And something that’s carried on from that period I never realized or worked for a company that they didn’t have an answering system. We if you heard the phone ring, it’d better be picked up within three rings.
[0:00] : Jim: [12:04] Right.
[0:00] : Red: [12:06] If you don’t have the answer turn around and find the answer somewhere else.
[0:00] : James: [12:11] Yep.
[0:00] : Jim: [12:12] But that’s what people still comment today. I mean, even when I’m on conferences or customer meetings they when they call in they’re amazed because it’s an actual person that answers the phone.
[12:22] And they’re kind of like taking back because they’re expecting press 1 for press 2 press, you know, 3 and you go through the [inaudible]. They’re like and a person answered on the second ring or on the first string. I’m like, yep. That’s the way it happens and it really makes a big difference to people.
[0:00] : Red: [12:39] Yep. It is it’s amazing.
[0:00] : Jim: [12:41] Red. Let me let me switch gears a little bit because again since I’m wearing I had to find it Well, it might be a Hawaiian shirt since I’m at the beach and again the Dolphins no haters now, but this was the only Santa hat…
[0:00] : [Red: [12:55] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [12:55] …I could find.
[12:56] Let’s you know, we know you well, but let’s bring this around a little bit to our to our audience and help them to get a little bit of a more of a glimpse into your side hustle because as we can all see there’s more to you than meets the eye so…
[0:00] : [Red: [13:10] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [13:11] …why don’t you explain a little bit about you and let’s just say your North Pole friends comrades as to what that’s all about. So…
[0:00] : Red: [13:19] Well, the cool thing about being a real bearded professional Santa is that I started this in 2002 got volunteered at church.
[13:33] Somebody said you’d make a great Santa. I looked at my wife I said, I guess I can do that. I can say ho ho ho I said, I don’t have a suit and I don’t have the beard. What are we going to do? And said, oh, we’ve got that all for you.
[13:47] So no sooner had I said, yes, and then also came with a script for the kids. Scared me to death. I had I was going to ad‑lib ho ho ho and everything was going to be fine. But I had to learn a script right on the spot.
[14:04] And so anyway, it was a shocker. But when I finished the kids eyes were all about the size of silver dollars and I told my wife I am so doing this because the feeling you get from it is amazing.
[14:19] But we do I do home visits, corporate parties.
[0:00] : Jim: [14:26] Yep.
[0:00] : Red: [14:29] Individual things and just sometimes just drive around in my wife’s red convertible Mustang and wave at people.
[0:00] : [Jim: [14:35] laughs] I’ve been in that Mustang with you and I tell you the…
[0:00] : [Red: [14:39] laughs]
[0:00] : …Jim: [14:40] looks on those kids are incredible. I mean incredible. It’s really fun. It’s actually…
[0:00] : Red: [14:46] Yeah, we have while I’m in that Mustang I have more Santa drive‑by’s what we call them of taking…
[0:00] : [James: [14:53] inaudible], yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [14:54] So I’ll be out on the freeway or highway and I’ll see a car in my peripheral they’ll pull up and back down, pull up and back down. And when I look over at them wave at them, there, there’s no less than three or four phones in there taking pictures. So…
[0:00] : James: [15:13] You’re a Snapchat legend, and you didn’t even know it.
[0:00] : [Red: [15:19] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [15:20] Yeah, for those behind the scenes this morning. We started this conversation. My daughter was here and I I may have grabbed her and let her talk to Santa for a minute. And…
[0:00] : [Red: [15:33] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [15:34] It was precious.
[0:00] : James: [15:35] There’s nothing like it for a three‑ or four‑year‑old to be able to talk to Santa especially in these off times. Like I’m not just talking. I’m not talking COVID. I’m sure anybody wasn’t even thinking about that. I’m talking more like summer.
[0:00] : Jim: [15:50] Yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [15:51] Yeah.
[0:00] : James: [15:51] We’ve seen we’ve seen Red at the Walmart before and and you know, he whips around and all the sudden, you know that little trip to Walmart on a Tuesday night is a special day.
[0:00] : [Red: [16:06] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [16:07] So I can’t imagine what that’s like for you as you move forward. So talking about that. I’ll tell you one thing. I miss is almost every year I’ve asked Red to do something, you know for my little ones whether it was a video or or you know a call or a picture or something like that.
[16:28] And Red, I know that’s something that you’ve done for a lot of people like you said not not including home visits and all the busy schedule of November and December that you keep.
[16:40] But what are some things now that now that you’re stepping away from EWN and be able to really focus on on you and what are some of the things both for obviously for what you’re doing, you know as Santa but also just as you personally.
[16:57] What are what are some of the things that excite you as you move in to this…
[0:00] : Red: [17:02] Well, in the purview of Santa it’s going to open me up for more school visits and talk about haven’t have crowd control when I walk in the room…
[0:00] : [James: [17:17] laughs]
[0:00] : …Red: [17:17] those things that you lose control of all of them.
[0:00] : James: [17:22] It’s kind of like when Jim walks into a conference.
[0:00] : [Red: [17:25] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [17:27] Very similar very similar. We have to have a handler that walks with him, but we’ve cut his hair during quarantine in the hopes that that’ll you know stymie some of that but it’s very similar.
[0:00] : Jim: [17:41] Ah, we may have stymied it a little bit but it’s ready to break out.
[0:00] : James: [17:46] So so Red, as we transition or we, no, us too at EWN…
[0:00] : [Red: [17:53] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [17:54] …without you, no, but as you look ahead into this new kind of section of life walking into retirement here in the next couple days, you know part of what I’ll miss is those personal messages and things that that I know you’ve always done for me and my kids.
[18:11] And as you as you look ahead both as Santa and as Red into your retirement what are some of the things that excite you that you’ll be able to kind of lean into a bit more on both sides of the coin.
[0:00] : Red: [18:25] We’re going to do so, my wife and I are going to do a little bit of traveling next month. We’re running down to, it’s not just a rundown, but we’re it’s pretty nice little drive down to Big Bend National Park…
[0:00] : Jim: [18:36] Yeah.
[0:00] : …Red: [18:36] down in the bottom part I’ve never been down there.
[18:40] And it’s going to be a double treat because I’m going to get the photograph the Milky Way and then one night they have the Perseids meteor showers going, I think it’s on the 12th and 13th is going to be at its peak and with all the dark skyrim. I should be pretty successful with it.
[0:00] : James: [19:04] Yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [19:05] And you’ll see. Some of those I’ll post some of those for y’all to see.
[19:09] But the other thing I’ve got a long‑term project that I am taking photographs from Vietnam. I was in Vietnam. I picked up my shutterbug habit, like most of the guys that went over we came back with I came back with cameras and a good stereo.
[0:00] : [James: [19:32] laughs]
[0:00] : Red: [19:33] And so it was one of those things, it stuck. I’ve been doing a lot of photography over the years in different places, but we’re looking forward to some of those chances to get out and you know call some friends in Fort Worth and Dallas and say hey, let’s get together for lunch.
[0:00] : James: [19:54] Yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [19:55] Never enough time to see the friends you’ve got and I’ve got them scattered all over the Metroplex and some up north.
[20:02] My kids live in my daughter lives in Chicago and my son lives in Boise and we’ve got a couple of major road trips planned for that. And I got cousins interspersed all the way around. [laughs]
[0:00] : James: [20:16] You have a lot of work to do to catch up with everybody.
[0:00] : Red: [20:20] It’s yeah, it’s going to be them.
[0:00] : James: [20:22] Red. What about what about the Santa side of your life? What what are you excited about leaning into there?
[0:00] :Red: [20:31] One of the things I it’s a project that I’ve had in the back of my mind for a very long time is and I’ve tested it in a couple of places is a personalized video from Santa.
[20:45] And the way it’s going to be set up is to the parent will give me a little bit of information one. Good and one bad one one good and one that needs improvement.
[0:00] : [James: [20:58] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [20:58] All right. All right.
[0:00] : Red: [21:00] And I will personally address to them.
[0:00] : Jim: [21:04] Got it.
[0:00] :Red: [21:06] And what that does is Santa is on TV talking to them…
[0:00] : James: [21:12] Yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [21:13] …personally talking to them the I’ve seen some other animatronic type things or there’s one guy that I’ve seen that’s got a beard and mustache that covers his mouth so you can’t see what he’s saying.
[21:27] But this is going to be one of those things. I’m probably, I hope I get to test it out this season and I’ve already gone out and purchased an old bankers desk. So Santa’s going to be sitting at his desk working with his quill pen on the naughty/nice list…
[0:00] : James: [21:44] Awesome.
[0:00] : Jim: [21:45] Red?
[0:00] : …Red: [21:45] talking to the kids.
[0:00] : Jim: [21:47] Let me just ask you a question. I just want to make sure for our viewers too that are maybe interested in that will your LinkedIn have the information going forward for all of that?
[0:00] : Red: [21:56] I’ll be putting in, I’ll put updates in LinkedIn. And then I also have a website…
[0:00] : Jim: [22:02] OK.
[0:00] : …Red: [22:04] a Santa Red site, its santared.net.
[0:00] : Jim: [22:09] All right, santared.net.
[0:00] : Red: [22:12] Yes. and just it’s gonna be a blast. I’d like to get back to school in 2010. We took a long weekend and went to Santa School.
[0:00] : Jim: [22:25] Oh I heard about that.
[0:00] : Red: [22:27] Yeah, up in Midland, Michigan.
[0:00] : Jim: [22:29] Yeah, yeah.
[0:00] : Red: [22:30] And so it’s been about 10 years since I’ve been up there. So on one of our road trips, they do it every October maybe next year for a break go up there and you can imagine I think they’ve grown there was probably 30 or 40 of us 10 years ago. And now I think the last one they had they had almost 150 Santas.
[22:53] So this Midland, Michigan’s a small town. So we almost take over this little town and everybody. Looks like I do.
[0:00] : [James: [22:59] laughs]
[0:00] : Jim: [22:59] Will you do us a favor and take some pics of that and post them so we could share in the joy?
[0:00] : James: [23:06] Is that legal? Can you do that?
[0:00] : Red: [23:07] Oh sure.
[0:00] : James: [23:07] Is that…
[0:00] : Red: [23:08] I can do that. I’ve got pictures from the last one and I’ll…
[0:00] : James: [23:14] It must feel like you walked into “The Matrix” or something. There’s a glitch in The Matrix and…
[0:00] : [Red: [23:18] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [23:21] Everybody looks the same.
[0:00] : Jim: [23:21] Yeah.
[0:00] : James: [23:22] It has to be a funny thing.
[0:00] : Jim: [23:24] Hey, Red.
[0:00] : James: [23:25] Jim, you want to take us home?
[0:00] : Jim: [23:26] Yeah, let me, well, I just had one final thought Red. I just want you know, you’re retiring you have a wealth in years of experience and such just in a a few words before I take us out, but do you have any words of advice for our generations that are coming into our workforce now?
[23:46] Anything that you want to share with them just a brief words of words of wisdom from Santa?
[0:00] : [Red: [23:52] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [23:52] And and yeah and Red I would even angle that further to to your colleagues your current colleagues and your future colleagues.
[0:00] : James: [24:02] I don’t think you’ll ever technically retire. You’ll be part of that family for long time.
[0:00] : Red: [24:12] No, no, I’ll be a EWN family for…
[0:00] : James: [24:16] For life.
[0:00] : Red: [24:13] It might cross over. But advice to the young ones, especially the kids out of high school if you get the opportunity. Try to get some trade skills done. We tend to focus a lot on video games and that sort of thing which are not bad. But if you’re going to do those things learn how to make them.
[0:00] : James: [24:44] Yep.
[0:00] : Red: [24:45] There’s there’s a excellent career in doing the 3D stuff that builds those games and if you’ve been a gamer all through your high school junior high and high school years, that’s a natural fit for you.
[0:00] : James: [24:59] Yep.
[0:00] : Red: [25:00] And job opportunities everywhere all the way from the Disneyland to or Disney people to just down to the local mom and pop shops. But as far as for people coming into Energy Worldnet in the future. Come in and prepare to just be amazed at the people that you’re going to be working with.
[25:26] Because it’s like I said earlier on I don’t know what formula the Hornbacks put together when they set this up, but we are all matched so well and I think James and Jim you both understand what I’m talking about. We just…
[0:00] : Jim: [25:42] Absolutely.
[0:00] : Red: [25:44] …we’re a big family. We won’t let people be unsocial.
[0:00] : James: [25:48] Not an option.
[0:00] : Red: [25:51] Not an option.
[0:00] : James: [25:53] If you’re unsociable, then we put you in a room with Jim for 24 hours.
[0:00] : [Red: [25:58] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [25:59] We lock the door. And then you come out social.
[0:00] : Jim: [26:03] Hard or easy, either one.
[0:00] : [Red: [26:05] laughs]
[0:00] : James: [26:08] That’s awesome, Red. Red, I think you and I share, you know, we immediately bonded there’s a couple things that we bonded on number one is we’re birthday buddies.
[0:00] : Red: [26:17] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [26:18] Funny enough. We share the exact birthday a few years apart but…
[0:00] : Red: [26:22] Yeah, a couple. [laughs]
[0:00] : James: [26:24] But then the other is we both had a passion for design. And so I echo what you said about a skill every opportunity in my life came if I trace it all back to the skills. I learned whether I when I was a developer or when I was when I designed. And they created those opportunities.
[26:44] Now, they may have been opportunities that put me in leadership positions or got us seats at tables to have bigger conversations, but the core of it came down to those trade skills.
[26:56] So I’m not formally trained, but I am a product of that very thing you said so I can’t echo that enough to so many people. Red, I want to thank you and I know Jim will this is the new handshake by the way, if especially in the virtual world.
[0:00] : Jim: [27:13] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [27:14] I have nothing but respect for you, Red. I wish you all the well‑being and all the fruitful retirement that you can can bear.
[0:00] : Red: [27:25] Thank you.
[0:00] : James: [27:25] And I hope that you wake up on that first morning excited and not going man. What am I going to do? [laughs] Because that’s a struggle some days too for people but…
[0:00] : Red: [27:37] I won’t have to worry about that. I’ve got a list and an arm‑long honey‑do list from my wife.
[0:00] : James: [27:44] No doubt about it.
[0:00] : Red: [27:45] It’s going to keep me busy.
[0:00] : Jim: [27:47] Yep.
[0:00] : James: [27:47] Absolutely. Jimmy…
[0:00] : Jim: [27:51] Yep I want to yeah, just continue on with what James is saying. Red, best of luck to you. We love you.
[0:00] : Red: [27:58] Thank you.
[0:00] :Jim: [27:58] And we’ll miss you the best of luck to you.
[28:00] We want all of our viewers to connect with you on LinkedIn, even if somebody needs just a little Santa cheer up or a special project or whatever again Red Shaw do connect with him.
[28:12] And on behalf of James and I for all of our friends out there and our new friends and old friends. If you want to come on the show and spend some time with us. We would love to have you just send us a message connect with us.
[28:25] We’re looking forward to many many many more episodes of Coffee with Jim & James as you folks out. There have made this the success it is today. So we thank you from the bottom of our hearts for that.
[28:37] Please take care. Stay safe. God bless you. God bless our industry, and we will see you next week on Coffee with Jim & James. Take care.
[0:00] : Red: [28:47] Thank you for watching.